|Research & Development|
I'm laying over here in Amsterdam for a few hours before I fly home (finally...I'm completely exhausted.)
Has anyone talked about the ability to send in two digital audio channels via the USB on the T1 engine? This allows many possibilities not just channels 6 and 7.
Also, you can send two channels of digital audio OUT of the T1 engine and program what's on them!
Neato keeno, I repeato.
Has Bose, with the T1 engine, addressed the issue with certain keyboard's "stereo samples" sounding phase-y with the L1?
Is there anything inherent in channel 4/5 that might fix this?
Or is this just a keyboard dependent issue?
That problem comes from 'stereo samples' that simply don't sum well to mono. I'm afraid that the T1 can't help with that. The solution, IMO, would be for the sound designers to check for mono compatibility at the source.
Thanks Chuck, that's what I though the answer would be.
I'd like to add something here for the drummers who might think about the T1.
Two years back, when I was having trouble with lingering sustain on my kick drum,
I bought an SPL Transient Designer, used, for $600, and it solved that problem for me.
But...it was heavy and bulky, and after a few gigs I stopped using it and sold it on eBay.
Now with the T1, we will be getting the Kick Gate, which no doubt will solve that old problem.
So in essence, since a drummer won't need an SPL, the T1 costs us -$100.
That is a bargain.
Redundancy check: I already mentioned this in another thread. Sorry.
All in all Ch 1,2 & 3 support:
The TS inputs are high impedance so you can plug in an acoustic guitar with passive piezo pickup or any other passive instrument directly without a pre-amp.This message has been edited. Last edited by: Hilmar-at-Bose,
It was asked if the channel outs are balanced, & the answer was that they are TS unbalanced.
Also, is the impedance still 1 megohm as it was in the PS1?
I believe all 1/4" outputs are balanced. Input impedance on Ch 1,2,3 is about 1 MOhm. 4 and 5 have an input impedance of about 10 kOhm.
Hope that helps
I was wrong on that first question. I always thought the channel outs were TRS balanced. That only makes sense.
As far as the ohmage of the inputs, we had talked on the forum here about 5 MOhm or 10 Mohm inputs since some passive pickup preamps are this high. I believe the highest pickup impedance I have seen is 10 MOhm. Is there any audible loading with running a 10 MOhm pickup into a 1 MOhm preamp?
Choosing the "best" input impedance is a little bit of a trade off and matching the pickup's impedance is not neccessarily the best choice.
Piezo pickups are also somewhat of a capacitor and together with the input impedance of the preamp, this forms a low pass filter.
If the impedance is too low, then the low pass filter is in the audible range and the guitar looses sparkle and gets a little dull.
If the impedance is too high, the system gets noisy and somewhat sensitive and finicky. For example, stepping on or simply moving a cable changes it's capacitance which creates clearly audible artifacts with a very high input impedance.
We feel, that 1 MOhm is a very good compromise for a life application.
Hope that helps
Thank you, Hilmar. I appreciate the insight. I knew that running a lower high impedance input into a very high impedance input was very inefficient & resulted in noise. The majority of users will not need a super-high impedance input & will suffer for it if it was too high. 1 MOhm is in the tolerance for most piezo pickups - probably all for that matter. I appreciate you taking passive pickups into account when designing the system. That is truly thinking wisely.
It is great that we'll be able to record via a master or aux out, but how about things that we don't want amplified live? Here's my specific case:
Vocal, Bass, Piano, vocal 2/flute - these items mic'd, picked-up, or lined-out.
Drums are straight acoustic with no amplification. Sometimes there may be an additional horn or two.
Is it possible (will it be possible) to mic the drums (and/or horns) for the sake of being able to record the entire show, but not have them amplified on stage? For what I do and where I do it, it's just not necessary to mic drums or horns. But it would be a shame and noticeably lacking if they didn't make it on a recording.
With 100 million iPods sold, I really think Bose missed the boat by not including a dedicated iPod/MP3 player input. A simple 1/8" jack and a volume control with the eq tonematched and the stereo properly summed would have been HUGE! The only thing better would have been a USB input that would power the iPod while it played!
Hi David E2,
If I'm understanding you, wouldn't you need a cable to connect to the T1.
Instead of a 1/8 male-to-male, you could use one of these to go direct to Channels 4/5 and have the options for ToneMatch'd presets.
You don't have to buy a $30 Monster brand cable but this would do it.
-- click for details --
From reading your posts the past few years it seems that you were always less than satisfied with the sound of your acoustic drums thru the L1(tm). You went thru great expense trying different outboard gear and microphones as well as countless hours of experimentation with different set ups and microphone techniques.
You finally decided that electronic drums were your best option for the sound you were trying to achieve.
With the claims of what the kick gate in the T1 does for acoustic kick drum, I am curious if you are going to give acoustic drums another try or if you will just stick with the e drums.
I wouldn't expect the T1's(tm) kick gate setting to be anything like the SPL Transient Designer. The SPL processor is not a gate. It is unique in what it can do.
The SPL is a single rack unit that weighs under 8 lbs and has an internal power supply. You consider that bulky and heavy?
I really, really hate external power supplies. It is too bad that if you use the T1(tm) with a C model L1(tm) that you will need to use an external power supply.
Yes, that would work, but it's taking up 4/5. I'm talking about a dedicated input or even better a USB port that would charge it too! ;-)
Does the T1 have little rubber nubs on the underside so that it can rest securely on the corner of my keyboard, virtually invulnerable to vibrations? Also, there's some warning in the manual about not using T1 outside--"The product must be used indoors. It is neither designed nor tested for use outdoors, in recreation vehicles, or on boats." Is this device any less rugged than its cousins?
Yes, it has rubber feet and sticks pretty well to most surfaces. It doesn't mind vibrations at all but since it's fairly lightweight it's more likely to move when heavily vibrated. Sitting on a keyboard should work just fine.
The T1 is most certainly as rugged as the rest of the family. I admit that the "indoor" phrase is a little confusing (partly due to legal requirements). It simply means that the T1 isn't completely waterproof. A few splashes of water won't hurt but having it directly exposed to pouring rain is not a good idea.
The generally guideline is: If you and your instrument are comfortable, the T1 will be happy too.
Hope that helps
The reason I went V-drums was to reduce my workload and reduce the painful volume of snare & cymbals, not dissatisfaction with the drumkit sound through the L1. I rarely mic'd the overheads, and yes, when I did mic them, I wasn't totally happy with the results for the work involved. But so many people told me that my drums sounded great on nights when they weren't mic'd, that I decided it wasn't worth the trouble of the extra mixer and mics.
I do plan to get a T1 and go back to the acoustic drums for a while, much to the chagrin of my band mates who love the electronics, and hate cymbal crashes in their ears. My back and my own ears are also grumbling about the thought of this, but I miss the dynamics of my acoustics. Even if (when) I go back to the V-drums, I want to have a working knowledge of the T1's Kick Gate so I can be of help to others.
The SPL was a great tool, and worked very, very well. But I had been trying to eliminate any and all "outboard gear". I only want drums and a compact sound system...nothing more. I have achieved that with my current setup, it lacks for nothing.
I agree that the SPL was no ordinary gate, but neither is the Kick Gate in the T1. They have stated that it is "Bose Proprietary technology". Bose designed it to do one thing, and even without having it in my hand, I know they will have succeeded. That's what they do, they love to cure our problems, for some odd reason.
Though they may call it a "gate", I think that is only so that we will easily understand its intention. So I'm confident that it is not just a typical gate. Cliff has mentioned that you can dial in the amount of "boom", something a common gate has trouble doing. He didn't mention if it can also dial in the amount of attack like the SPL did, but again, I have faith that Bose has designed a useful product at a great price.This message has been edited. Last edited by: Drumr,
Thanks for clarifying.
Acoustics & DSP
That's correct, Pete. A typical gate looks at the input all the time and opens when it sees anything big coming in. It stays open as long as the input looks big, then it closes after the input gets small again. Although this will suppress noise, if feedback gets started, the typical gate will stay open and keep feeding back, because the input (the howling) is still large and stays large. Feedback causes the gate to get "stuck open". Such a gate would only suppress kick drum feedback for as long as the drum is never hit. Not very useful.
I can talk fairly freely about the KickGate because we've filed for a patent on it. The KickGate IS a kind of gate, but it is different in three ways.
1) First of all, it won't open for just any old sound. It is looking specifically for the signature of the beater hit. No other type of sound will make it open (I hope). In particular, it won't open for the sound of the kick drum feeding back, or even the sustain of the drum sound. It also resists opening for snare, tom, or cymbal hits or bass guitar notes. Pays no attention to them. That's the first difference and the hardest part of the invention. Hilmar, Mike, Bill and I all contributed to making this part work well. The gate opens for beater hits.
2) Once the gate opens, it is GOING to shut about 1/4 second later, no matter how loud the sound is at that time. Kick drums are impulsive sounds. We know they should stop quickly and we stop them by force ... by shutting the gate when their allotted time is done, whether the drum has shut up or not. The only exception to this is if we detect another beater hit while the gate is open. The second hit, and any subsequent hit, resets the clock so the gate stays open for 1/4 second after the last beater hit, then shuts. This allows the drummer to double-tap or use two beaters and two feet for a kick drum roll.
3) There is one more difference to talk about. Hilmar designed the gate to snap open and snap shut very fast without clicking or popping. And since we shut the gate after only 1/4 second, the drum sounds VERY tight with the KickGate engaged. It can be even tighter than the real drum itself, drying out your amplified drum completely. Most drummers like that BAM, BAM tight sound. They get in their punch as quick and hard as possible and get out of the way so others have room to be heard. But for some music, a boomier drum is appropriate. (I always think of the bass drum in a marching band.) So the tightness control on the KickGate controls how slowly the gate closes. Close it fast and you get "BAM", close it slower and you get "BOOM" or even "BOOOmmm". The sustain only happens when you have the gain up high though, because it's actually the sound of the drum trying to feed back! But the KickGate is slowly crushing that feedback down. (Bwahh-hah-hah! Puny feedback, I squash you like a bug!)
So how much more gain before feedback can we get on the kick drum? Actually we don't know. We haven't found the limit yet. We stacked B1s around the kick drum and played with no problem. We even held the kick drum mic right up to the face of the B1s with no problem. No pile of bass boxes and no amount of gain we've tried yet has been able to break through the KickGate. Ain't science fun?
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