I think some of the difference in opinion here comes from not separating performance from entertainment.
In an earlier post when speaking about using lyrics, I said, "if you are in a request, background music, type of venue it might go unnoticed. If the venue is performance oriented one might be judged harshly".
By definition I think a musician / singer might be one or the other, maybe both or perhaps to some audiences, neither a performer, or an entertainer.
I think the performance by yoko mentioned earlier is a radical example of "performance art", that few would find entertaining, and you probably won't be invited back if you do that number in your local dance club.
johnny wildheart of the UK said, " It's been 25 years since I played covers in clubs, but I don't remember the audience coming to "listen", (I thought it was drink, bingo, dance) and there always were requests!" He's not talking about a performance oriented venue. It was about 25 years ago that things began to change from what had been listening venues to participation venues, where the audience had more influence on the repertoire than they had previously.
I remember thinking when karaoke first started, if I could have had access to that medium in the 70's I might have made a fortune, now that I think about it I'm not so sure, but when it came about it changed the face of club entertainment. Because now anybody could do it.
As I said earlier, and it is my opinion that, "the cream comes to the top" So I think in an effort to compete, and stay in a business that they were used to, quality musicians moved into the lyric and track world.
One only has to look at the "Idol" programs to realize that in the early segments an outrageous act has a very good chance of being aired. What does that say about the general public's desire for entertainment? And the outrageous acts, do they realize they are bad and just want airtime, or do they not know the difference?
The pool of folks wanting to be entertainers is much larger with the introduction of technology, and unfortunately the most talented have to work under the same auspices as the least.
I will always believe this phenomenon has more to do with the onslaught and acceptance of technology on and by the masses than the desires of musicians.
There are few holdouts left and even fewer places for them to perform. When I find myself in a new town I used to enjoy walking the streets to hear the buskers, but alas tracks have even found their way to the street corner.
Maybe I'm just old and see one more piece of my youth slipping away.
Well Papa go to bed now, it's getting late
Nothing we can say can change anything now
Because there's just different people coming down here now and they see things in different ways
And soon everything we've known will just be swept away
So say goodbye it's Independence Day
Papa now I know the things you wanted that you could not say
But won't you just say goodbye it's Independence Day
I swear I never meant to take those things away
I have watched Austin City Limits and saw paper taped to the floor for set lists. Those type of performances is like a concert. These groups don't take requests. They play their set list and go home. We on the other hand play for 3-5 hours any and all kinds of music. I play sax in a group, I have the music in frint nut it is only reference.
just my 2 cents
yes i HAVE seen acts do this .
That's not what anyone HERE is doing!
Please bring back the days of organist and drummer and get some life back in these clubs!Using actual sheet music,
Are they allowed to look at the music?
Yes, and please bring back the days of heavy amps and monitors and guitar pickups like they had in the seventies and...
As we get older, everything is heavy to lug in/out of a gig. The days of heavy gear is out thanks to Bose.
Are you for real ???
The organist and drummer are not there to entertain , they there to play the acts music .
Have i hit a nerve mr.wildheart ..
you aint one of those acts who needs prompts/words are you ? learn the <<colloquialism>> songs !
Its just plain lazy......
only one good thing about ipads(with mic stand adapter) , it does away with an act using a music stand with the words in front of them which looks terrible, its so unprofessional.
Edit: Forum-Admin removed a colloquialism that could be offensive to some readers in different parts of the world -- please see our Terms of Service link at the bottom of every page.This message has been edited. Last edited by: Forum-Admin,
thats just being silly , technology has moved on brilliantly with bose(and others) , but its no excuse to have ipad karaoke apps telling you everything thats coming up. thats one step too far , u will all be miming next ...to some ipad app that throws your voice for you.
Its a profession please treat it that way, the gap between any old karaoke singer gettin up earning a livin as a club act, and those who ARE proper acts is gettin slimmer and slimmer with technology like karaoke apps on a phone/ipad....dont let them ruin your act.
Please consider the following before posting replies here. Ken wrote this in another discussion, but it is applicable to this one.
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|Research & Development|
Well hello everybody!
Let's go for a walk.
Get some air.
Take a time out.
Maybe give this a little rest?
I am certain in many cases, because I know some of the folks posting to this discussion and have heard them play, and damned confident with those I haven't, that you are all superb musicians and professional artists.
Point well taken Mr. Moderator. I shall cease writing on this matter. I'm closing in on a decade on this forum and I'm sure I've never seen anyone so intent on telling all of us what is right and what is wrong in performances.
Over and out...
sorry guys... let the debate continue.
i promise i will be a good boy tee hee
I think its clear where we stand on this matter and that is why its heated ,we all have our own opinions because we are all passionate at what we do, which is GREAT !
I'm with Wayne on this one. Goodbye!!
Not only could this stand to cool down a bit, it has gone beyond the normal levels of respect and informational content that we have come to appreciate on this forum. Game over.
I think Wayne summed it up perfectly. When a third party doesn't seem to be able to understand the point of the discussion, then it becomes a pointless exercise. I'm done on this one. Goodnight.
Hello All: I use Swift Elite Lite to both schedule "backing tracks" and, if necessary refer to the screen within the program to indicate words... I have over 7000 songs in my system. I am not a very good memorizer of words of songs I have song but only once or twice. I do know the melody on all... but as for words.. well I am not a rocket scientist. And one thing further, I don't know about many, I do sing between 45-55 songs per evening. And not bein g a here, I sonetime adjust the key a step down.. All this is done automatically prior to show time.... Try it...Tricera Swift Elite Lite"... you will see the difference.....
Great comments posted here and I relate to most of them. I can play old Cat Stevens and Don MmcLean without cheat sheets all day, however, I am now 62, still gigging and having the time of my life with words and chords out front. I look away as often as possible , wear shades, and get away with it. The result is no wrong words, and a great song list to pull from. I get hired back regularly. My problem now is to get rid of the " big lyric book" and go with a touch screen of some sort like a reader .What's the best???- I play outside too in the sun? Thanks for any help.
what product do you find works best , for outside gigs in the sun as well.thanks,brewster
I use an iPad and have all my charts on their via pdf's. I used to lug around 2 or 3 huge books for all the songs (over 500 of them).
I do remember seeing some video of some big name acts like Cheap Trick and others where one of the stage monitors was actually a teleprompter for the lyrics . . .
You do what you need to do to earn a crust!!!
Any pro muso does what is needed!!!!!!
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