Folks,

I have a problem. I have a drummer that has a lot of drums. Not only that, but he's one of these pseudo-sound-engineer types that has a mackie board, a rack of dohickies, JBL 15"s, big *** monitors, blah blah blah. He's not a big fan of Bose gear, as you might have guessed.

Everyone else in the band is absolutely sold. I need advice on a really good setup for acoustic drums to bring the drummer on side. Basically, I need a solution for drum sound re-enforcement using an L1 that will convince him.

Some information on us: We are a 4 piece original rock band with Guitar, Bass, Drums, and a lead vocalist. We play fairly loud (12 o'clock on the remotes). The drummer has a 6 piece maple kit (snare, two rack toms, two floor toms, bass drum with a double kick pedal), Overall the kit is very shiny and expensive. Currently we're running two L1s, but would get a third just for the drums.

Any advice for us? Mics? Placement? stage setups?

Thanks in advance,

Trevor

Hi Trevor,

Put the Drums on the side instead of the middle.

Picture coming.

Hi Trevor,

Here's a quick Sketch I put together by looking at your website http://www.efarmrocks.com/



-- click image to make changes to the live version --

And here is how you could set up with the Drums on the side.


-- click image to make changes to the live version --

Trevor on Guitar and Vocals
I am guessing that you do some signal processing on your Guitar, but I didn't show it here.

Theresa Vocals, Dasha on Bass (Double Bass System)
Dasha can have some signal processing for the Bass if she wants.

Arthur on Drums and Vocals (Double Bass plus PackLite® Extended Bass Package (PackLite® amp + two B1 Bass Modules))
I have shown Vocals and Kick Drum microphones direct to the L1™ and any other microphones into a Mackie mixer, and eventually into Channel 4.

Putting the Drums on the side does a couple of things for you (as a group).

For the Drummer, this gets him out from between to L1™s. Because it can get fairly loud in there, it can make it difficult for him to hear himself. That should be easier with him over to one side.

Getting the Drums out from the centre of the stage should also make it easier for everyone else to hear themselves. The result should be better monitoring for all.

quote:

Overall the kit is very shiny and expensive.

Ooooh...pretty. Is it the same kit as in the pics on your website? That is a fairly common setup among drummers. I notice his cymbals are on the big (loud) side, many of the L1 users and quiet combo drummers use smaller, quieter diameters. If he is anything like me, he probably has a closet full of little cymbals at home. Ask him to try them.

quote:

He's not a big fan of Bose gear, as you might have guessed.

I"m betting he soon will be. Once you get him off to the side, and facing the band members a little bit, he will love being "in-the-mix", for the first time in his life.

You don't say if he is a *heavy-hitter*, but if he is sensitive to the rest of the band getting the volume down, I'm sure he'll follow suit.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Drumr,

ST,

you amaze me buddy! Don't you ever sleep? and the Rick guitar image as well! That's pretty cool and very nice.

So you figure that we should run Art's vocals and the bass drum directly into the L1, and use a little mixer for the other mics? I hadn't thought of that -it makes quite a bit of sense. Ditto for moving him over to the side.

I am concerned about feedback with the tom-tom mics with that sketch. Do we just orient the mics away from the L1 and hope for the best? Any advice for EQ on those mics? BTW, we're already using OM5's for all vocals which work very well for us.

BTW, Drumr - no, he's upgraded from the kit that's shown on the website. The kit he is using now is an all wood/maple kit - very very shiny indeed. The old kit is now his backup kit that sits in our rehersal space. Fortunately for us he's not a heavy hitter - mostly :-)

Hi Trevor,

Glad you liked the Rick image.

quote:

So you figure that we should run Art's vocals and the bass drum directly into the L1, and use a little mixer for the other mics? I hadn't thought of that -it makes quite a bit of sense. Ditto for moving him over to the side.

This way Arthur gets to use the Presets for the Vocals and the Kick Drum. I'm not a Drummer, but I *really* like the sound of the Kick Drum Presets. If he wants to go full-tilt, he should try the T1 ToneMatch™ audio engine. There is an effect in there called KickGate that is astonishingly good.

I hope some of the Drummers will chime in here to help with mic'ing the Toms.

ST

Nah, life is too interesting to spend too much time sleepin' eh?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: ST,

quote:

Do we just orient the mics away from the L1 and hope for the best? Any advice for EQ on those mics?

That's the best, yes, and it's not that hard to do, keeping the mics aimed away. Go for *flat* EQ, move the mics for the best sound. But the thing is, for most smaller venues we all play, that you really don't often need to mic the overhead drums much, if at all.

The kick is the one drum that really needs mic'ing, and as ST said, the KickGate is an amazing thing, and that feature alone is well worth the price of the T1. I was trying out a SINGLE B1 Model II last night and by using the kick gate I was actually able to get a kick signal that was loud enough to be usable live. Before, with the Classic and no T1, 1-B1 was never enough...two was not even enough for me. So I bought the Packlite and a total of 4 B1s. Four B1s is great, but there is then a problem of too much bass *resonance*, which the KickGate cures. It's amazing the difference in volume level you can get when using that KickGate.

In addition, if the drummer has a Classic L1 and a T1, he has a total of 5 XLR mic inputs, which should cover his (1)vocal, (2)kick, (3)snare, (4)rack, & (5)floor toms.

Hey Mayfly
Ditto to what ST and Drumr have said.
1) Drummer to the side

2) Keeping the mics aimed away from the L1.

3) L1 model1 (2 extra presets comes in handy for a drummer) 4B1s with Packlite and T1.
If he does get the T1 he might want to try preset “Hand Percussion SM57” for the toms. I was pleasantly surprised.
Rick

You have received better advice than I'm about to provide, but consider this:

Let the drummer keep his old school gear and make each band member responsible for his/her own gear. When the rest of you have you L1's set up in 5 minutes and are plugged in in 10 ready to go, and he's just finishing load-in, maybe he'll reconsider.

John

John,

I think that's the best advice I have heard on this issue. Next gig - that's how it will be :-)

Slam dunk John!